CNN: Report: Fat Americans getting even fatter
Extreme obesity is ballooning in U.S. adults
Tuesday, October 14, 2003 Posted: 9:11 AM EDT (1311 GMT)
It's no secret that Americans are getting fatter, but the biggest Americans are gaining weight faster than ever, a new study shows. CNN's Christy Feig has more.

•CHICAGO, Illinois (AP) -- Americans are not just getting fatter, they are ballooning to extremely obese proportions at an alarming rate.

The number of extremely obese American adults -- those who are at least 100 pounds overweight -- has quadrupled since the 1980s to about 4 million. That works out to about 1 in every 50 adults.

Extreme obesity once was thought to be a rare, distinct condition whose prevalence remained relatively steady over time. The new study contradicts that thinking and suggests that it is at least partly due to the same kinds of behavior -- overeating and under-activity -- that have contributed to the epidemic number of Americans with less severe weight problems.

In fact, the findings by a RAND Corp. researcher show that the number of extremely obese adults has surged twice as fast as the number of less severely obese adults.

On the scale of obesity, "as the whole population shifts to the right, the extreme categories grow the fastest," said RAND economist Roland Sturm. He added: "These people have the highest health care costs."

http://www.cnn.com/2003/HEALTH/diet.fitness/10/13/extreme.obesity.ap/

Thoughts of the epidemic of obesity? SOlutions? Reasons? Comments...

I think that we as Americans have deemphasized the importance of physical fitness. Our children play outdoors less (for multiple reasons) thereby become obese; PE has been cut back so far in our schools that it's not the same class we took as teens. The cafeterias serve fattening food. And even as adults, with more money and more options, it's not easy to find healthy alternatives for lunch or breakfast on the go. Micky D's doesn't serve fresh fruit, or granola. Burger King doesn't have tofu on their menu - And, it's difficult to find places that do. Not to mention the added "expense" of eating healthy. A .50 cent bag of chips, or a $2.00 salad? Hum...if I eat a salad I'll be hungry in an hour; the chips will hold me until dinner.

Also, I hear about the increasing amount of "steroids" in food, and that may contribute to "bigger, rounder" people as well.

The answer is as simple as it ever was.

Too much food.
Too little exercise.
Fear of numbers.
Unwillingness to self-educate about nutrition.
The unpleasantness of being hungry while losing weight.

The cost of fresh produce is still a serious problem for the poorest people, but for most Americans it's not. That $4 pizza and $5 half-gallon of ice cream buys lots of bananas, apples, scallions, etc.

And there are some other exceptions: Lots of popular meds, including antidepressants, can cause serious and uncontrollable weight gain. So, maybe, can changes in metabolism caused by morbid obesity.

But the fact that we've got grossly unrealistic ideas of how much food people need doesn't help. Nor does the fact that we've essentially given up. It's getting hard to find a pair of pants that doesn't involve spandex or elastic, even for teens. Just a couple hours ago my (significantly overweight) husband and I were laughing about "invisible" copy in the Eddie Bauer catalogue. Example: "elastic side panels for extra 'give'...for your extra 'fat'."

Mya's answer is actually a pretty good example of general lack of nutrition education. Looking for "healthy" foods at McD's, she wants granola. Granola's not particularly healthful stuff, high in sugar, highish in calories -- the medium-density fiberboard of whole grains, with syrup for glue. It just has good marketing. As does tofu, though tofu can be quite high in fat and calories, even if it's not fried. Other "good marketing" foods: salads (with dressing, cheeses, egg yolks, fatty meats, in gigantic bread bowls), grilled chicken sandwiches (2-3 portions' worth of meat, with mayo, on heavily buttered buns), "egg beaters" omelettes (cooked on a greasy grill, with 3 oz. cheese and 3 servings' worth of pancakes), all-fruit ice pops (made of frozen fruit syrups), etc....I eat all this stuff, btw. But I have a general sense of how much food I'm eating & how many calories are going in v. out. If my accounting's off, I gain weight, and that's a tipoff to fix it. Works every time.

The low-carb diets aren't genius either, since they're just another way of avoiding learning basic nutrition and doing the arithmetic. My FIL's idea of following that diet was to walk around eating spoonsful of PB, and he wondered why he couldn't lose more weight....My MIL actually bought him pork rinds to eat while he was on that diet.

Losing weight is not complicated for most people, if you're disciplined enough to mind the numbers, and you're willing to live in a way where your body can get enough exercise. That means reasonably low stress, lots of freedom to move around and exercise during the day (I mean sweaty exercise, not go-for-a-stroll exercise), minimal time sitting, using feet more than car for transportation, refusing to eat for entertainment, and eating much less than adults are expected to eat now. That's not easy in this society, and it's harder if you have trouble conceiving of lifestyles different from the ones handed you. But I think that's what it takes.

amy

I must talke about this while we are on the subject of obesity:

I know fat is on the rise, for reasons that have already been posted, nintendo games, instead of climbing a tree, we are a face passed society, and many cant seem to find the time, or have enough energy to prepare healthy food. Every thing is becoming soo high tech. I mean really, way back when people washed their clothes by hind, hunted their own food which meant running and dragging their prey through the woods, the women were at home to prepare the food and tend to children,(most parents are both working and have to today in this age) there was no television and late came the radio. People used brooms and not a sweeper. Yes, even washed their dished by hand. There are remote controls for darn near everything. Heck, we even have cruise control on the cars for heaven's sake, not to mention automatic redial!!!!!! Okay, enough on that.

I was reading my new letter that I get from the ANA (American Nurse Association). In one article, I had gotten the impression, they accepted ridicule for having had an obese nurse on the front issue of a previous cover. Basically saying they were sending a the wrong message, and how nurses and what they stand for should not be examplified by an overweight nurse. I was uphauled, and this is coming from me, a person who is not overweight!

First off, many obese people have psychological issues. Others have an inheritied trait, or has been found in some cases (genetically linked or not) to be deficient in a signaler for feeling satiety. Instead of ridculing these people we should treat the reason why they are this way. And let's remeber that there are many young women with eating disorders (anorexia, bullemia) because of the message sent through magazines like Cosmopolitan, and Glamour. And I will be damned as a nurse, if I will support the ANA to send, although be it inadvertantly, the same message. I see many dieticians, nurses, docs, etc. who are overweight. And have other bad habits. It would be unrealistic to broadcast such people across the US as just thin people. And for those people who for instance are obese because of an inherited trait---well that's not quite fair. After all, that thin nurse on the cover could have bullemia, or even anorexic, and appear as such---is anyone gonna whine and complain about that?

Unfortunately, for most of them there's nothing to treat except environment. Most overweight people are not victims of genetics -- if they were, we'd have seen this problem long ago. If you can't make it easy for most people to lose weight -- and that means having food less available and exercise less avoidable -- they're not going to muster the necessary discipline. You can throw the whole pharmacopaeia at them, but it really won't do as well as less food, more exercise. And for that, the food industries, working conditions, and neighborhood setups will have to change. I don't see it happening anytime soon.

amy

Amy, I agree wholeheartedly with your good, old-fashioned common sense. Sethina, thanks for bringing up this topic. I am currently applying to preventive medicine residency with the hopes of making a difference in public health efforts to combat modifiable risk factors for our biggest killers--heart disease and cancer.
I would love to hear anyone else's opinions about solutions to the obesity problem.

I think that the way suburbia is set up is a recipe for weight gain. Everyone drives, there are fast food joints everywhere, and generally not too many parks to go to. I live in a metropolis where you can get anywhere by walking or riding your bike.

I also find that if you work long hours or shift work, it's very difficult to maintain a balanced diet. Often you have to squeeze in a meal, and sometimes the only thing available is fast food or a candy machine!

I myself am not overweight, but I have to make a conscious effort to watch what I eat. Cooking at home is a good solution, as long as you buy healthy groceries. Finding a form of exercise that you can enjoy is another key to losing weight.

I also think that weather plays a part in obesity. If you live in a place that has cold winters, it's hard to stay active. You tend to want to stay indoors and crave sugar and carbohydrates.

Just my :twocents: !
M-A

I live in the upper Midwest, where it gets very cold and windy. -30F with wind chill isn't unusual here. But again, it's all about how serious people are when it comes to staying at a reasonable weight. Despite the queerly fascist tones of the instructors, the FIRM videos are very effective workouts, assuming you don't have musculoskeletal problems. I shoved the coffee table out of the way this morning at 6:30 and did a strenuous 1-hr aerobics workout. Equipment: Floor, TV/DVD, set of 3-lb weights, small weighted ball, kid's plastic stepstool. I vary morning exercise so I don't get bored (aerobics, sculpting/weights, Nordictrak, Pilates, yoga), but it still adds up to about an hour each morning. Back when I was in jr. hi, before the exercise boom, I used to just put on a tape of music I'd got off the radio and run in place, do calisthenics, etc. All indoors.

If you don't have kids keeping you from exercising outside, good outdoor-exercise equipment in January here includes Mad Bomber hat, down coat, insulated pants, wool sox, thick scarf, good boots, heavy-duty gloves, walkman, boss headphones (I like Grados, they're like taking the club with you and they keep your ears warm too). That's for walking; for running, a thick turtleneck, thick sweatshirt, thick tights, pants with some kind of wind resistance, lightweight Thinsulate gloves, and a fleece hat with earflaps will do you just fine, no need for expensive performance materials unless you're running 1/2-marathon or more distances. When it gets below 10 degrees F, I like to add a lightweight, non-fiber-waving face mask, something the air has to go through before it gets to my mouth. Stops mild cold-induced asthma.

If you can't stand cold and have an infant, you can strap him/her on and go for a walk in the mall, a treadmill, an indoor track...you see where I'm going. If you really want to get the exercise in, cold weather won't stop you.

As for carbs...=) Do the exercise and stay reasonable with the calories, and you'll be pretty OK, carbs or not. If you want to be neurotic about it, you can get a drugstore glucometer and see how well exercise keeps your blood sugar in check.

amy

I hate to even weigh in on this discussion because I am overweight, but since I didn't shy away from the other debate I guess I will go ahead and add my :twocents:

I was always very thin and very consientious about my weight. My mother, on the other hand, has been obese throughout my entire life. I never understood why she didn't just "get some control" and exercise more/eat less. I was very unforgiving in my opinions. I also grew up with a father that monitored my food intake and made fun of fat people....if he saw an overweight woman jogging, he'd scream out at her "too late, honey" :twocents:

kris

First, let me apologize for being a tad defensive in my response...I'd change it if it wasn't for the fact that I hadn't logged on and so I can't access it....can you tell weight is a huge issue for me? Sorry for offending anyone.

As to solutions....I would agree that we have a distorted idea of what people 'should' eat today. I'm shocked by the fact that burger king and McDonalds now have those 'big kids' meals now, for example. I ate a 'happy meal' on the occasions that we ate out until I went to college and it was more than enough....it seems to me that we are training our children at younger and younger ages to eat more.

Our children's school cafeteria now even allows children to get two meals instead of one They actually sent home permission slips at the beginning of the year. We declined to sign.

Also, when you go out to a restaurant the portion sizes are HUGE...It's like getting three meals at one time.

I recently ate at Fridays with my husband and since I'm actively watching my weight I ordered a Cobb Salad with the dressing on the side. They brought me out what could be considered a platter full of salad...not a plate. I immediately had them bring me a to-go box and put 1/2 of it away before I even started eating...because I knew that if it was sitting on my plaste I'd probably eat it all...not out of hunger, but just because it was there.

I think a lot could be done to limit portion sizes in restaurant and provide healthier options in fast-food establishments. Also, you are right that healthy foods are more expensive. It is cheaper for me to buy a box of those $1.19 twinkies for the kid's snack than to buy a bag of carrots. The catch-22 though is that the farmer has to be compensated.

kris

I don't think you were being overly defensive mommd2b. If it was as easy as just having a disciplined personality/character, I don't think there would be so many otherwise hard working and high achieving people with weight problems. I was an athlete and a dancer when I was younger and always skinny, but after kids and quitting smoking and working crazy schedules, I really struggle to keep the weight under control. I know how to get it off - it's just that in order to keep it off I seem to have to be obsessed with keeping up my exercise routine and then I don't have time for anything else. And I don't even live in the states where you are confronted with giant portions, fast food and disappearing sidewalks.
I think it's also a problem of modern city layouts that don't encourage or allow walking to work, school, shopping.
(Since I've given up on making it to the gym or out for running regularly enough to make a difference, I replaced my old sofa with a treadmill 3 days ago, which is my favorite equipment from the gym. I also walk my daughter to school and myself to work most days and to do the shopping - but it probably doesn't help much since I'm so close anyway.)

Limiting portion size with a walk or run (treadmill when too cold) seems more realistic than buying a whole wardrobe for exercising in the cold. And most people cant seem to set aside time to do that.

My exercise is doing housework, chasing kids, and going up and down my stairs. Working on my feet 9 hours. I am not going to get up at 5-6am at this point to exercise, it is unrealistic for me. I am not overweight. Not that my metabolism wont slow down someday.


Yes, for a lot of people their lifestyles are the reason they are obese. But there are some with genetic inheritances that was noticed long ago, for example, the PIMA indians.

I think that we can easily talk about how to manage weight when we're referring to the usual 5-50 lbs that the average American needs to lose. I think that it's a different issue when we're talking about someone who is morbidly obese.

When someone is 100+ pounds overweight, it's not just a matter of walking 3 days a week or choosing grilled chicken over beef. It's not a simple matter of self-control. I don't think we can put the 2 issues in the same place.

I would also suggest that it is more than a matter of restaurant portion sizes. My kids naturally stop eating when they are full, no matter how much food you put in front of them. They will turn down dessert if they ate their fill of chicken. But we as adults (I'm generalizing) eat past the point of saiety. Why is that?

I know I eat to soothe stress. Maybe the culprit in America has more to do with the amount of pressure that we are under than the portions that McD's gives us. Afterall, they wouldn't make it if we didn't buy it. Why do we buy it??? Are we greedy as a culture? (the more I get for my money the happier I am?) Are we so sure we can't live up to our Hollywood ideals that we don't even try, but swing in the opposite direction? Is our culture so repressed and miserable that we substitute food for emotional/physical intimacy or satisfaction in other forms?

My grandma once said that what was wrong with america was that "with all this television, everyone got to see what they didn't have and it made everyone unhappy!"

If we're going to help people tackle the obesity problem, we're going to have to do better than sell them another diet plan or aerobics video.

I'm fortunate not to have a weight problem, but I am close to people who do and I have listened to their struggles. I just don't want to belittle their difficulties or make it a matter of waking up one morning and "just do it."

Because it tastes good and we're used to the discomfort of overeating. We don't stop to think about the relative value of 69 cents v. our own health, so we eat it all rather than throw some away (or buy less in the first place).

I don't mean to belittle anyone by saying weight loss, for the vast majority of people, is a matter of calorie control. But like I said, you have to be prepared to live against the American grain if you want a fairly easy road to fitness and a healthy weight. We chose our town and our house in part because this area's safe and walkable, we're in bike distance to most places we want to go, and in walking distance to grocery/cafe/parks/etc. We could have gotten a huge, gorgeous Victorian an hour away for the same money we've spent on a small suburban insta-box, but independence from cars is that important to us. We essentially have a spare car, because my husband uses his about twice a month. I didn't have a car until about two years ago, and I'm 35. If you're used to using your feet as transportation, you eventually collect foul-weather gear. Saves on frozen toes.

One of my top requirements for a job is that it not involve hours at a stretch sitting or being fairly still, and that it allow me time for strenuous exercise and moving around. About two hours of exercise and walking a day is about right for me. Sure, that limits the job opportunities and the income; it's a matter of priorities. Living against the grain, again. If someone's priorities involve sitting at a desk for long hours, long commutes, living on an American scale, and committing to the point of not having time for exercise, then yes, it's going to be very hard to find time for exercise. But I can tell you, I've lived in loud apartments in bad neighborhoods while being dirt-poor and working 70h/wk at min-wage jobs that leave you with bone-tired feet and legs, and I still managed to exercise regularly.

I live in this body 24/7 and it mediates my experience in this world. After taking care of my daughter, it's what I take care of first. Frankly, it's part of why I've got no intention of having more than two children. Living this way also ensures time to remember who you are; walking home from work ensures a pressure-valve no car commute does.

I never did say it was easy, psychologically or situationally. But simple, for most people, yes. As noted, there are exceptions. High levels of stress can make weight loss difficult, as can certain drugs (steroid and antidepressants, for example). And yes, there are populations that are famous for obesity. For the vast majority of people, though, enough exercise (more than most people think) and avoiding overeating (less than most people think) does an excellent job of warding off obesity. If that weren't true, fat as a norm would be old, old news.

amy

Unfortunately, the things that will work run smack into vested interests. The food industry has a vested interest in your overeating. The housing industry has a vested interest in your living in a giant house fifty minutes by car from where you work, which ideally is far from dense and aging multiuse city zoning. The auto industry wants to sell every adult an SUV. The video-game industry wants your kids to sit still, and so does the tutoring industry; the toy industry wants you to pay extra for a motor on the scooter or play-car. The clothing industry wants you to get fatter; that's what sells men's clothes, anyway. (I'm not joking.) There's no diet industry without fat people. And your employer doesn't want you taking a two-hour lunch/gym break or leaving early because you've done enough sitting today.

Helping people tackle the problem will require political courage on a reforming-Social-Security scale. Until it happens, I think all we can do is encourage people to resist what comes easiest and privately provide ways to help them do that. Donate gym memberships. Volunteer to help sedentary girls play sports. Teach nutrition and cooking in community centers for free. Publicize nutrition info. Organize community "weight-watchers" groups. Provide sliding-scale therapy so people can learn to deal with their problems in ways other than eating. Support and donate to rails-to-trails projects. Buy poor women sports bras and good sneakers. Raise money so schools don't have to go begging to Coca-Cola.

I think stuff like this will still miss the majority of people; it can help the motivated, though.

amy

I'd like to recommend two books that I read recently.

1. Fast Food Nation

2. Food Politics : How the Food Industry Influences Nutrition and Health

These were VERY enlightening. With Fast Food Nation I permanently changed our food purchasing and eating habits.

Anyone else read them?

Sethina

What do you think of the gastric bypass surgery? I read an article yesterday saying that more than 120,000 Americans will have the surgery this year.

One of my girlfriends from high school (24 yrs. old) just had the surgery, which her insurance did not cover. She's still in a lot of pain and is concerned that she'll always be in pain and it wasn't worth it. Fortunately, there is a support group in my hometown. I was surprised that she had the surgery because she was overweight, but not morbidly obese.

Actually, what are the technical definitions of overweight, obese, and morbidly obese?

Do you think the surgery should be covered by insurance? The article I read said more companies are covering it because it's less expensive than paying for other medical complications related to obesity.

Amy, you and I have differed on a lot of topics, but I must say that I wholeheartedly agree with what you said in this post.

Theresa

You might or might not be surprised to hear that this surgery is being done on adolescents now! I think we are failing our kids miserably in America when we begin to resort to this serius a surgery at such a young age. (It's not the surgery or the surgeons I'm criticizing, but the fact that it even needs to be an option for any but the most rare of cases.)

Even 24 seems too young to have already exhausted all other options and made permanent(mostly) changes to internal organs.

Theresa

Sethina, I've been looking at the first book cover for about a year now & thinking "gotta read that" -- what's the second one like?

This is slowly changing, but it looks to me like the people most at risk for obesity are still middle-income and lower and associate's-degree and lower for education. From my own experience being very poor, it looks to me like the main barriers are the price of fresh produce and lean meats, social factors (women not supposed to work out, etc.) and the price of gyms, including the Y. I didn't know how to stay fit and healthy either at $7K/yr, and it took me a few years to work it out. While we can't change the price of supermarket food on our own, I've thought for a while it would be helpful for a sports or medical society to sponsor nutrition/shopping/cooking and exercise classes for TANF, Section 8, Title XX and food stamp recipients. With childcare provided.

This spring I'm setting up a parent's group locally (again, childcare provided), and I'm still looking at the possibilities for providing pre/postnatal exercise classes for free or very low cost in low-income-neighborhood community centers and the local community college branch. A barrier there is certification cost; it's high enough that I have to find out whether going without certification raises liability exposure. (The one place I've found that does certify for perinatal has some pretty dubious exercise physiology going on anyway.)

other ideas?

amy

This may be true, (though obvously since such a large percentage of our population is now overweight people from all income levels share this problem ) but from what I've read, parental obesity and RACE are larger factors. Apperently, even in high income minority families obesity is more prevalent. I'm not sure what accounts for that...any ideas?

Most of the studies that I've seen that discuss obesity and social class involve teen-agers though. I did read study though once about the link between our more high-stress jobs and having less time to prepare meals...I don't remember who authored this study, but it showed parallels when restaurants or fast food chains entered a market to weight gain in the population.

alright, check this out

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/3253632.stm toddlers weaned to fast food

http://www.thewbalchannel.com/health/2676620/detail.html
Feds offer new guidlines to curb obesity. Will this work?

I doubt it. Doesn't work in my house, anyway. My dh's doctor reminds him that his BMI puts him in the "obese" category -- that does a great job of making him feel crummy about himself, but doesn't change his eating or exercise habits much. "Pants too tight" works better.

amy

Sethina,

I have read Fast Food Nation, and yes it is very enlightening. Quite scary isn't it? I also would recommend this book, it's very interesting.

M-A

It is in my opinion, that americans are just going to get more obese. Think about it...genetics....environmental adaptation...we are soo high tech, dont have to do as much for ourselves to expend energy, we will eventually adapt to this by having lower basal metabolic rates, etc, etc. Sure this will happen over a period of time--but I think it will happen.

Thinking more fundamentally, some people may choose to have a shorter but more qualitative life as they perceive it, than to live a longer, less qualitative one. My point is, if a person enjoys eating soo much, maybe they are happy with enjoying food and feel as though they have a better quality of life and would rather have a good quality of life, living shorter than to have a less quality one and live longer. After all, quality of a person's life is what he or she perceives it as, not necessarily what you or I do. Just more food for thought.

I did a stress test last week on a lady who had gastric bypass eight or so months ago...she goes to the support group (80 lbs lighter, looking VERY different) and tells them how her life IS WORSE; her lady friends are jealous of her newfound body, her husband goes into jealous fits bc other men look at her now...she is OVERALL UNHAPPY ( and may have cardiac disease nonetheless)
Have a girlfriend who had gast. bypass in the late eighties and of course she has gained a lot of the weight back ( as most of them do) she just eats smaller meals more frequently...

Just FYI, there is a new procedure , that I think is called gastric banding---where a band is wrapped around the stomach somehow instead of bypassing it. I just heard about it, the first procedure was done not too far from where I live.

Yeah, I'd agree if we were a nation of fine-food lovers. I don't think that's the case, though -- I think most people just kind of grab & stuff, often hardly tasting the food. (If they did, we wouldn't have half the junk food we do. I remember Doritos after a few months away from that kind of stuff in Brussels, where they eat v. nicely -- tasted like cardboard coated in salty floor sweepings.) The hospital where my husband works has some of the worst cafeteria food I've met; somehow they make fries and grilled cheese taste bad, and good luck finding a reasonably balanced and calorie-controlled meal. But people eat (lots of) it, because it's what's there.

Btw, where you were growing up & going to college, did the guys engage in eating contests? I swear I never heard of such things outside of fraternity festivals until I moved out here. Never heard 18-24 yo guys bragging about how much they can eat. One friend just lost a bet that he could eat 16 McDonalds apple pies in an hour -- and he's trying to get into med school! I don't get it.

amy

More info on attempts to curb in UK

http://media.guardian.co.uk/advertising/story/0,7492,1099981,00.html

The Food Politics book is pretty good, reads more like a text book though. Has a great section on advertising to children that makes you blood boil.

This is very true. When I lived in Germany, I lost the freshman 15 that I had put on my first couple of years of college and was in the best shape of my life. Why? I think it had to do with the culture.....I rode my bike or walked everywhere...everywhere...and there is a different lifestlye about eating food. The largest meal of the day is eaten at noontime not in the evening...and the food was much more fattening than it is here...and much more tasty...but it filled you up and gave you a different satsifaction. You ate less but enjoyed it more.

Not only that, the lifestyle in general was more relaxed...6 weeks of vacation a year, all stores closed by 6pm including grocery stores...except on Thursday when they were open until 8pm. I hated the fact that the stores were closed for awhile. I thought the people were just plain nuts....there was not a 24 hour anything open...no wal-mart, nothing. But what a relief after awhile.....After work, you came home and spent time with your family. If you forgot to buy something you have to wait until the next day. It seems like a pain-in-the butt to those of us used to the 24 get-u--and-go life, but it really forced relaxation. No more pressure to go-go-go....you just came home and relaxed and spent time with your family. Sundays nothing was open...and so families went on bike rides/family walks.....You couldn't go to the mall or run to Target for something.....no grocery shopping, etc.....It was family time and time to prepare for the week. It was a relief after awhile to not HAVE to be somewhere!

We did our grocery shopping daily and planned the meals that day. That meant our food was fresh and we didn't just grab something to throw in the microwave.

Whenever we are in germany for a few weeks, I come back here and actually feel overwhelmed by the noise and stimulation until I get used to it again (2-3 days). I honestly would prefer a quieter lifestyle. Interestingly, everytime I am there I lose weight.

My mother-in-law was here for the last month and she was kind enough to cook for us every single day. She and I had our breakfast together after getting my two oldest off to school. We enjoyed a cup of coffe and toast with butter and marmalade on it.....Lunch and dinner were both very much german style and were 'fattening' by any American standards...and yet I lost 12 pounds in addition to the baby weight that I lost right after Aidan was born before she left...and I felt so much better about myself.

I find myself slipping into those bad routines again. I get the kids up and out the door and then I eat breakfast by myself....when I eat alone, I tend to eat more. I eat lunch alone...again...tends to be more and something 'easy'....which tends to be something that I can pop in the microwave or something that I pick up through a drive-thru :guilty: By dinner-time I find myself snacking and again overeating.

This is a very interesting topic....with no easy answers, I'm afraid.

kris

Hey, I saw a really neat gadget in Runners' World last night -- it's a resting metabolic rate analyzer, and you just hang out & breathe into it for a while. Measures V02, so I guess it's interested in the inhale, not exhale. Called a BodyGem. Available so far only to medical customers, so nothing you'll find at CVS. Wouldn't it be neat, though, to see those in schools and in mall kiosks? Find out your resting rate, estimate from that your daily caloric requirement, and get examples of how much food that is. Would take a lot of mystery out of chronic overweight for a lot of people.

amy

[/QUOTE]Yeah, I'd agree if we were a nation of fine-food lovers. I don't think that's the case, though -- I think most people just kind of grab & stuff, often hardly tasting the food. (If they did, we wouldn't have half the junk food we do. I remember Doritos after a few months away from that kind of stuff in Brussels, where they eat v. nicely -- tasted like cardboard coated in salty floor sweepings.)

amy [/QB][/QUOTE]


Aaah, yes. But what you consider fine food may not be the same as another considers it. Some people consider hostess cupcakes just as fine as another considers veal saltimboca.

Haaa, funny-the dorito thing!

No, I never knew of the fella's indulging on an eating contest. But I dont doubt that it doesnt happen.

Sounds to me like this lady may need a "Husbandectomy" and possibly a "Friendoplasty"

I too, have read Fast Food Nation- a very interesting read! I have not eaten at McDonalds since (14 months!) I have eaten at plenty of other fast-food places, though, so I suppose they are not much different. I also heard that the US food industry makes enough food for 5000 cal day per person and they are doing their best to sell it to us. That is one reason that I am a huge fan of NO TV. We don't have outside reception in our house (just DVD and VCR)- but I could start a whole 'nother thread about that! check out www.tvfa.org.
Heather

But how do you live without C-SPAN? =) Oh, hail, mighty C-SPAN, committee meetings rule, there is no quorum for a vote and Karl Rove is a tool

But seriously...we don't keep a TV in the LR or kitchen, and travelin' food is frowned upon, so that cuts down on the zombie/snack. It helps that we make a lot of fun of enormous food, since clearly the huger the food the tastier it's supposed to be. I want to see a molecular-level closeup of a Hardee's Thickburger.

Oh, and something else that works well -- I get my husband some snacks to put in his lunch (yeah, call me Wifey), but I got annoyed with paying obscene prices for the individual-pack things. Got some boxes of goldfish crackers & pretzels & made single-serving packets, measuring single-serving by the nutrition-info panel. Not only good for lunchbags, it's a pretty forceful reminder of how small a single serving is.

amy

I'm surprised that no one has mentioned transfats! Transfats are those nasty fats that give all those products in the inner aisles of the supermarket their shelf-life. For These are the hydrogenated or partially hydrogenated fats. If you've taken some chem, you probably already know that transfats look stericly like saturated fats but are actually much worse, since they essentially tell cells to bring fats into cells and tell them not to let fats out (HDL goes down and LDL goes up). According to the prof of the biochem class I'm auditing, there are no known safe levels of transfats! and yet these are what we are consuming by the fistfull when we eat wingdings, twinkies, most supermarket-bought cookies, cakes, crackers...

Another big beef of mine (sorry 'bout the pun), is high fructose corn syrup. I don't have hard data about high fructose corn syrup, but it's very hard to buy any non-diet "drinks" without it. High fructose corn syrup is another of those products that was engineered to sell product -- it's the ultimate in "empty calories," and it acclimatizes so many people to expectations of an extreme level of sweetness.

The third of my complaints about industrialized food is superheated fats. Again, I don't have any data about the chemistry of these things, but it can't be good. Fast food restaurants heat fats to temperatures greater than those any of our ancestors ever saw. These fats slow down metabolism... and, of course, added to them are the artificial flavors that are engineered to make you want to eat more and more, to make those french fries taste more like french fries than french fries themselves...

My last complaint is that industrially produced and packaged fresh fruits and vegetables have dubious nutritional value -- when the FDA says a vegetable has x% of the RDA of a vitamin, how can we as consumers be sure that that's true now that fresh vegetables can be packaged to have a long shelf life? So even when you try to eat a healthful veggie, you may be getting less benefit than you thought.

So... along with shooting for an overall balanced diet... I try to stick to 100% juices (watered down, since they still have lots of sugar), eat organic as much as possible, eat whole grains as much as possible (since they're full of fiber, take longer to be broken down, and are very satisfying overall). Of course, I still crave oreos or ice cream from time to time, chocolate of course, but when I do eat them, I make sure that I really enjoy them!

Sorry to be so longwinded, but I really wonder if these industrialized products have done more to contribute to our nation's obesity than has been noted. Products with a long shelf life, fast foods, sodas, are all products marketed directly to kids, and especially to the poor. The transfats may actually hinder the body's ability to convert fats into sugars...

that's it for now, thanks if you read this far! :rolleyes:

I still suspect obesity's largely a matter of calories in > calories out. It's certainly the most straightforward answer. Though general ignorance about nutrition combined with the ADM corn-syrup train probably does lead to people eating a lot more than they realize.

Whazza matter with ice cream? Yow, girl, you're insulting one of my favorite food groups. That reminds me, I better get ordering those Belgian chocolates from Leonidas. Makes See's taste like it came out of an Easy-Bake Oven. All natural and no preservatives, yes indeed. Means you got to eat them all up fast. I recommend their Manon Cafe buttercreams.

amy

I just read an interesting article about whether obesity should be treated as a lifestyle (solutions eat less, exercise etc) OR a disease (drug companies sell solution as a pill).

What are your thoughts, lifestyle or disease?

Yes, you are 100% right Amy it is about intake v output and also about learning what food is really about i.e. what is fat and why we need some, and which ones we need.
Obesity is a lifestyle problem that if ignored can cause the early onset of more serious diseases.
People do not want to take responsiblity for the extra kilos gained, and this is why I left private practice. People would come to me and say " you must help me lose weight, give me a diet that will make me lose". And they would take offense when I tell them diets don't work, you have to eat properly and do excercise not only for a few months but for the rest of your life. They thought that because I am a dietician I must have a magic formula. Losing weight is 10% about the food and 90% psycological, and it is hard, you have to constantly motivate yourself to make the right food choices and to excercise. But we want a quick fix, we see celebs pregnant today and back to their pre-preg weight tomorrow and we are told that this is the norm. We don't see obesity
as a health risk but as a cosmetic risk.

The best thing we can do for our children is set an example, "children learn by what they see". Start at an early age to teach our kids about food and what it does for our body. Teach them it is ok to leave some for later. When time permits let them help to make meals and use this to explain why we need carrots etc. Teach them to have a healthy attitude towards food. There are no good and bad foods but there are foods that we can only eat sometimes because....etc. This is where the biggest obesity risk is, our children.
Thanks
Maxine & my :twocents:

Sethina, I'd call it a lifestyle that leads to disease. Again, I'll point out that there are some groups who have a serious disadvantage here: those on weight-gain-causing drugs, some small ethnic groups, etc. But in saying "lifestyle"...I really think it bears the marks of addiction. Many people seem to have all the same trouble putting the Taco Bell down that others do with the booze.

I think the "obesity pills" are just a mark of the medical community's growing frustration/desperation about this problem. But honest to God, if you don't have lots of snacky deliciousness around, you use the portion sizes of yesteryear, and you stop eating when you're full, you're pretty unlikely to be obese. Even if you're not much for exercising. Gah...I'm reminded of a dinner out with my in-laws, both very nice people, very overweight and out of shape. My FIL couldn't finish his pizza (which should've fed three people), so he gave the last slice to my MIL, who was already groaning about how stuffed she was...and she found room for the pizza. Maybe a national "doggy bag" or "2 meals for 1" campaign would be helpful...I'm serious; restaurants know people expect humongous portions, and people feel they must clean their plates. The bonus is that a lot of the doggy bags get thrown out, since restaurant food's a lot less attractive after 24h in the fridge.

That's a really good point. It'd be helpful for people to see just how those stars get back to size 2 so fast, not to mention more graphic representations of conditions related to obesity.

It's funny, my husband and I were talking about some changed norms in this country over the last 20 years -- acceptance of obesity, acceptance of debt. I'm writing a website for a student financial-counseling service here, and it's made me think a lot about how having thousands in high-interest consumer debt has become normal. In 1985, having a few hundred in credit-card debt was a scandal. It makes some sense of general attitudes toward federal debt, I think. Similarly, you don't hear people fretting about 5 or 10 lbs anymore -- if you're only 10 lbs overweight now, most people will call you thin. Instead people tend to need to lose 30 or 50 lbs. I think our tolerance for this has definitely stretched, and I agree, that's because it's seen as a cosmetic and "acceptance" issue. It's not seen in disease terms, maybe because it's a new phenomenon and most people are not yet associating fat with, say, diabetes.

amy

You are right about nutrition and our children. It is so important to teach our children about good nutrition. My DH doesn't understand why, as an adult, that HE needs to eat his peas/vegetables of any kind. I keep explaining to him that the kids need to SEE him eat his vegetables. Good examples are so important for young children.

Also, I was teaching a class at church that was about nutrition, I had to explain to a bunch of teenage girls that carbohydrates are ok....but that carbs didn't include cheese nips, and doritos. For some reason they associate certain junk food with carbs. Not a good thing!

but dhigbee, those foods are mostly carbs. Have a look at the nutrition info. Doritos have a lot more fat than cheese nips do, but they're still basically corn.

The questions should be "How much nutrition are you getting for your carbs?" and "What percentage of your calories are coming from relatively unprocessed carbs, and how do you feel eating that way v. different percentages?"

If you're talking oatmeal, fresh fruit, and many other relatively unprocessed high-carb foods, you're looking at getting a fair amount of vitamins and fiber along with your carbs. (I'm not convinced by the glycemic-index talk, btw. I've tested it on myself with a glucometer, and my blood sugar follows roughly the same pattern whether we're talking sucrose or apples.) You also get a lot more chewing and portion restriction, much of the time.

As for percent, the fat/carb/protein balance that feels comfortable and maintains healthy weight seems to vary pretty well among people, & seems to be partly reliant on what kind of activities they do. But most people seem to feel best with a healthy chunk of their calories coming from carbs. 40-60% seems to be about the range, from what I've seen.

Frankly, I kinda doubt eating Doritos/cheese nips/whatever, even daily, is going to affect most people's health if they keep it to a single serving and have healthy diets otherwise.

amy

Amy,
What I'm saying is that they are afraid to eat the good carbs, i.e. whole wheat bread, corn, potatoes or other nutritous carbs because they are being lumped into the same catagory as cheese nips and Doritos, etc, which are nutritionally deficet. The Atkin's diet is largely responsible for that one. I was always taught that food that were high in sugar, fat, and calories, and have little nutritional value is junk food.

yeah, I see what you're saying. I just wish people would talk about food in a more straightforward way -- I sometimes think that in an effort to simplify nutrition, diet experts make things a lot worse. I mean there's no such thing as a bad food. Your junk food, for instance, comes in serious handy when you're competing athletically or on endurance events. It can also just be plain tasty and harmless as a treat, in moderation. Seems to me much easier in the end to look at carbs, fats, proteins, fiber, vitamins & minerals, and ask yourself how much you need of each at any given time, then eat accordingly. It doesn't require walking around with a calculator or assay equipment. A few weeks of education will give you a good enough sense of what nutrients are in what food to wing it.

It's kind of like the talk about "flab" that persists. There's fat lying over muscles that are small because you don't use them. No such tissue as "flab".

amy

I am responding to the comment about our acceptance of debt, in addition to our acceptance of obesity. I think it all stems from too much TV. I find myself perfectly happy with what I have until I spend some time watching TV (at a relative's house or on call) and I start thinking "boy, it sure would be nice to have x." If it can get to me like that, imagine the power it has on our children.

I think it's true that our culture wants that "quick fix" or "instant gratification." And it doesn't help that our "role models" are the celebrities we see on TV, movies, magazines, MTV, etc. I know several women who have had babies this year, and most of them went on the Atkins diet or some kind of diet to help them lose weight quickly. And to most of these women, losing that weight is the biggest accomplishment they could ever achieve. Usually the first thing that comes out of one mom's mouth is, "Oh, you've lost so much weight . . . you look so great!" And it doesn't help that the husbands are also giving them a hard time to lose the weight. It really frustrates me because I have dieted before, and I know that diets are only short term - but very quick fixes. I've gained the weight back in the past and lost it again. And now here I am 18 mos. after having my 2nd child, I've lost some weight and I hope to be in my prepregnancy clothes by spring - almost 2 years after her birth. I try to keep in mind that losing the extra weight is a health issue, not a social approval issue. It's hard to do.

It requires a lifestyle change for each overweight person, and even more importantly, it also requires a cultural change in the way women's bodies are viewed. There are a lot of hypocritical attitudes in our culture. Several TV shows have an overweight husband with a slim attractive wife - how about that for a subliminal message to all the people watching those shows. Plus, some of these moms who make it their life's quest to lose weight within the first 2 months of giving birth also don't want their daughters to play with Barbies because of the negative body-image they might get . . . but these mom's don't even realize that they are the biggest influences on how their girls view their own bodies. :banghead:

I could go on and on, but I'll stop here . . . until I have more time later

Vanessa

I'm back again for just a few minutes

I guess I'm really passionate about the issue of girls' self-esteem/body image because I had these issues myself growing up . . . and sometimes I still struggle with them especially when my friends are so obsessed with losing weight and dieting. I have 2 girls and I want them to have a healthy body image and positive self-esteem without obsessing too much about worrying about my girls (a vicious circle?). I love to exercise and try to workout at least 3-4 times a week, but my biggest battle is with food and portion control, because I absolutely LOVE food . . . ice cream being my favorite food group I've learned to not eat everything on my plate a restaurant and I try very hard not get a second helping at home. Like a lot of people have already said, huge portions and restaurants, the transfatty acids in foods, the bombarding of food commercials on TV make it hard to eat healthy. It's a challenge for us in the society we live in today to live a healthy life . . . but what I've been learning over the last few years is that it seems that the right thing (living healthy) to do is always the hardest thing to do.

A concept from economics helps me a lot here, especially when it comes to chocolate. It's the idea of diminishing returns -- the idea that the first unit of something gives you terrific benefits, but as you add units, each unit gives you less and less benefit. The first piece of chocolate is fantastic, and the second and third are pretty good too, but by the fourth or fifth chocolate I'm on autopilot and not tasting it so much. Beyond that, it still tastes good, but I'm starting to feel sick, and I know it's not worth the calories & sick feeling. So if I want a snacky treat, I get a small portion -- that way I can't overeat. A few candies, a half a slice of pizza, whatever. (It's a good idea at restaurants to ask for a take-out box before you even touch the meal, and put half of it in the box, then ask the waiter to take it away & bring it back with the check.)

But I remember going through a grocery checkout line with a bag of three or four Brachs candies, and the cashier looked really sad as she weighed it and said, "I wish I had that kind of control." I don't know how many people feel that way, or what can be done to bring them out of it. Again, it's the kind of thing that makes me think of addiction issues.

amy

Ooops...it looks like I didn't operate the quote button correctly!

For a great book on the emotional weight of food... (sorry about the pun)... I highly recommend "Appetites: Why Women Want," by Caroline Knapp. Knapp was a gifted writer with a lot of insight into her own and other women's complex relationships with food. She was anorexic in her 20s, and she fought back to become healthy and fit...

There are some interesting discussions on food in The Economist...

http://www.economist.com/opinion/displayStory.cfm?story_id=2282754

WHEN the world was a simpler place, the rich were fat, the poor were thin, and right-thinking people worried about how to feed the hungry. Now, in much of the world, the rich are thin, the poor are fat, and right-thinking people are worrying about obesity.

Evolution is mostly to blame. It has designed mankind to cope with deprivation, not plenty. People are perfectly tuned to store energy in good years to see them through lean ones. But when bad times never come, they are stuck with that energy, stored around their expanding bellies.

From the Economist editorial:
Statistically, yes, insurance co's should be allowed to discriminate. Unfortunately, I don't think this would change a damn thing...in fact, given that 2/3 of the US population's overweight, I think we'd have rioting at the ballot box. Even if it stuck, we'd just have a lot more fat, uninsured people. This proposal's one of the many "people work like logic machines" mistakes that those on the right are so prone to.

amy

Depression, depression, and depression. That's what it is for a lot of people, and the important thing is THEY DON'T CARE. They're too depressed to care.

I betcha my bottom dollar that if there were less child abuse in this country, people would be thinner. But then you can argue saying that there's child abuse in other countries and they don't gain weight, right? But the thing here is that food seems to be on the Top Ten List of act-outs or "bad habits that make us feel good" in America.

Nobody ever thinks about the "emotional" causes of obesity enough. I've seen on other message boards where people were calling the obese "lazy.” But again, what nobody thinks about enough is "what causes the laziness".

Yes, we all have pain. But another thing many people in this world don't understand is that everybody has different ways to make them feel better. Where food works for one person,- obsessive sex, being mean to others, anal retentiveness, cigarettes, drugs, over-working, or bulimia works for another. We are all unique in how we cope with our pain or "nurture ourselves". I think we need to focus more on this point, in my opinion.

I will have to agree with you on that one!

http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/news/7764544.htm

Did you see this report. Obesity cost a massive $75 billion in 03 in US

I am a surgeon who is appalled at the option of obesity surgery. Do potential patients understand that there is a 0.5% chance of dying, and 2-3% chance of severe complications, including wound infections, multiple operations, etc. I have spent too much time taking care of patients with complications to recommend the surgery to anyone. The current effective obesity operations prevent the patient from eating very much, but do nothing to the psychological component of eating. Patients can defeat the operation by drinking soda and high calorie liquids. My mother said that she was sending me to medical school to learn the cure for obesity, and my answer was that I already knew the cure for obesity -- "don't stay home and care for ungrateful children for 17 years." I think the money is better spent on working on the psychological components of eating issues, and a gym membership at Curves!

Well said mommidala!! :yes: