I am a physician who works full-time, and usually I get home around 7-8pm. I drop my kids (3 yo twins) off at daycare on the way to work, and my husband picks them up around 5 pm.

We have a nanny/parent's helper who prepares dinner for the family, does some light cleaning, and takes care of the kids to get them through dinner, bathtime, and bed time. When I hired her, she reported that she had completed education in British schools in Hong Kong and had 2 previous jobs as "nanny" and reported that she was a "housekeeper" at a major hotel, but after she started working with us, it was clear to me that she had limited childcare experience (her idea of watching the children was to watch them as they climbed on the bookshelf and not say anything), English was a problem (my 3 year olds were correcting her as she sang the letters in the ABC song in the wrong order) and had no attention to cleanliness (soiled pull-up diapers would be left lying on the floor for 1-2 days) and would often leave food out overnight. We critiqued her for some of these things, and decided to keep her on since the kids became used to having her here, as opposed to starting with another stranger. My husband became unemployed last summer and I wanted to fire the nanny at that time since finances would be tight, but my husband convinced me to keep her on in case he found a job. It has been 6 months now, and he is still unemployed. After mortgage, car payments, student loan payments, daycare, we are just barely getting by each month living paycheck by paycheck. In these tough economic times, I myself am working harder even though I am paid less so that I won't get cut(I am not partnered yet). Really, the underlying issue is that my husband should be pitching in more at home. That's a whole other issue that we are working on, but this week a new issue came up.

This week, our nanny/parent's helper asked for a 20% raise. I feel like her initial salary was generous considering she had exagerated her previous experience and we were already giving her a break. Our own economic situation is tight with my own medical group cutting salaries by 10% this past year and my husband becoming unemployed this year. I explained this to her, and her reply:
1) Why should our family's finances affect her getting a raise? (Hello?? Where am I supposed to get $$ to give a raise? Do you realize that a lot of families are laying off their nannies when 1 spouse becomes unemployed?)
2) I told her we could re-address the issue of a raise once my husband finds a job. She told me that she wanted a date when this would happen. (If I could predict the turnaround of the recession, then I wouldn't be working in medicine)
3) She quoted a $20 per hour rate advertised on listings for "nanny". (She in no way functions independently. She can't even read a book to them as she can't read in English. She decided on live-in situation since transportation daily would have been an issue with her as she does not drive and her home is about 1 hour away on public transportation.)

She also recently started submitting bills TO ME at the end of each month for her snacks, shampoo, toothpaste, totalling $78 last month. She even charged me for the boxes of Ritz crackers and candy she bought the boys last month that she wrapped up and pretended were Christmas presents for the boys. The children are in daycare from 8am to 6pm. During the day, she is free. Her only duties during the day are to do the kid's laundry on Mon and Thurs, and to get the family dinner ready, which she often just thaws out leftovers that I have brought back frozen from my mom's house. My husband always at home with them when she is with the kids. I feel that she is more of a parent's helper.

I told her "no" to the raise. I really cannot afford to pay her demand. I apologized and told her she is free to go find a better paying position. Today she asked me again. I am not really sure how to respond to her further.

Well, I don't have any experience with nannies, but from reading your post I'd be really inclined to let this one go. She doesn't sound like she's terribly helpful and she's making unreasonable demands. Your husband wanted to keep her on even though he's unemployed - do you think having her around is beneficial right now? Enough to be worth the cost? I realize that you'll want someone once your husband finds a job, but do you think you'll remain happy with this person? It sounds like she will continue making demands for a raise, especially once he becomes employed again. If I were in your shoes, I'd fire her (with some notice, of course) and worry about hiring another nanny when the time comes. Yes, there will be some inconvenience around finding a new nanny, and your kids will have to adjust to her, but it might very well be worth the bother. The only real question I have is will this be an issue for you and your husband in terms of your relationship? Tensions about home responsibilities can run high, especially when a husband/father finds himself unemployed and expected to pick up slack around the house. Even if you do decide that you need a nanny right now, you still might want to consider searching for a new one.

Just my (inexperienced) two cents. Good luck figuring things out!

OMG let her go. She's a whiny lier and it sounds like she's already overpaid. Not sure where you live, but $20 per hour sounds like a whole lot to me, especially since she lives with you (meaning you feed her, give her a roof, pay for her electricity/water/etc) and she does not even watch the kids independently. I would at the very least refuse the raise (just as you did "I cannot afford it, I understand if that's not acceptable to you and you're free to go"). But really, I would let her go.

I pay my sitters $10 an hour (occasionally more, or round it up) for two kids. I would suggest going to a local college (education or early childhood ed department) and asking them for recommendation for evening parent helpers. If your husband is home, you could even get a high school or even middle school student, to occupy the kids and be a true "parent's helper". The other option, if your daycare allows, is to ask one of the teachers if they would be available to help on (at least some) evenings. Usually daycares have part-time employees who are college students and struggling for money. From your description, it sounds like all of these options would be better than who you have now.

Best of luck to you!

To me this sounds like a golden opportunity to strongly "suggest" she seek a job elsewhere, and then just not replace her. I certainly would never pay someone to sit around my house for 10 hours a day. I'm with babyE, get a helper in the evening if your husband really can't cope (really?) and continue daytime daycare. I realize you're in a high cost of living area, but I don't pay my (full-time, unsupervised, American) nanny that much to watch my FOUR children for 45 hours a week. She needs a reality check.

I am with all of the others-let her go. That is way too much to ask-she is totally taking advantage of you. If your husband is home, get a college student to help out. i have several that have experience with early childhood ed and they work out great. If they are home alone with kids and have to get dinner started or put kids to be I pay $10-15 an hour for three kids. If we are there with them, $10 an hour. If I am around i have some reliabel HS students help me out. Sounds like you really need to have that discussion with your husband about taking on more around the house soon though, if finances are that tight.

I'm with the others on this one.

In addition, it doesn't sound like she's someone you'd want serving as a role model for your kids - even if she were free!

20 bucks an hour PLUS room and board, PLUS she wants you to pay for her personal items (ask her if she would be expecting her boss to pay for her toothpaste and shampoo if she worked at McDonalds for minimum wage)???!!!

Give her notice, tell her it's just not working out and that she will be so much happier working for the people who will pay her 20 bucks an hour. Then get your husband up to speed watching the kids until you can find a high school or college girl to help out in the evening for 10 bucks an hour.

Good luck.

I vote for firing both the nanny and the husband. You are working very hard. Get someone in there who will really take care of your kids and your house and will support you.

LOL, sahmd.

Thanks for all you replies. Last night, I got home early, so I took care of the kids in the evening. The nanny made dinner, but didn't even cut up the food for the kids or prepare their dinner plates. She said, since I was home, she thought I would be doing it. I really started wondering... what am I paying her to do????

My husband and I are discussing how to let her go. It will be more stressful for us. But the reality is that we really need to figure out how to take care of the family by ourselves. He realizes he needs to step up to the plate.

PS - She asked for a raise again this morning.

i am glad your husband is going to help out more. i agree w other posters- she has gotta go! and you will have $800 + more per week w/o her.

LOL!

It is stressful to let someone go, but I suspect I would have been so angry by this point if this had been one of our nannies, that I would have had no problem with it. This woman is really taking advantage of you, and you have every right to be angry and just tell her she would be better off somewhere else. The one nanny I was about to fire quit on me, hoping I would beg her to come back. Boy was she surprised when i didn't (the kids told me that she told them not to worry, that I would not really let her quit).

Good luck, and I'm glad your hubby is going to pitch in.

So I think you will all be happy to know that Friday will be the last day for our nanny.

This evening, she ran up to her room to answer her cell phone after the kids got home from daycare. (I remind you, the kids are a daycare from 8am until 6 pm. She has all day to make her phone calls). She was in her room for 20 min and my husband knocked on her door and said, "Hey, time to get to work" as it was time to feed the kids their dinner. She turned to my husband and said, "I have an important phone call. I work hard all day long, 24 hours a day."

It is an insult to me, as I am working over 12 hours per day, often skipping lunch, working hard taking care of sick cancer patients. And the person that I hire to help care for my kids after daycare does not do this because she conveniently has to talk on the phone after the kids get home and has to watch her special tv program at 7pm, DURING the time that we needed the most help. Gosh if I could be home at that time, I wouldn't need to hire someone to help. And on top of that she has this delusion that she is working hard 24 hours per day! Listen, lady, I know what hard work is... and you haven't demonstrated any.

She is out of here! My husband is going to tell her Friday morning that we cannot afford to have her with us anymore, and we'll pay her for another 2 weeks, but she needs to pack up and leave! I don't want her around my children a single minute after she finds out that we are letting her go.

Good for you, tsunami!

Great! Good luck with the transition. I hope everything goes well.

Whoohoo!

Yeah! I have been watching this thread and have to say I was horrified by what I was reading. Very scary to think of the lack of work ethic and sense of entitlement!

I totally agree with having her leave with two weeks pay and not being around the children- she sounds vindictive.

Good luck!

Thank you for your support.

As Day 0 approaches, and she has no clue, she again took the opportunity this morning as we loaded the kids into the car to ask me for a raise because it is very hard to take care of my kids. I told her no again.

Unfortunately, my husband was not home today, but Friday will be the day we give her the bad news because my husband will be here to enforce it and give her a ride where ever she needs to go with her belongings.

I agree with everyone else, and I'm glad you are letting her go. I would make sure to get any keys from her that night and make sure to change any passwords she has knowledge of to make sure she has no access to anything.

I hope you have a smooth transition. Hopefully your husband will find a job very soon and you find someone who actually helps you all with the kids. It sounds like you are working extremely hard and things are stressful. Hang in there, Mom!

Thinking of you today and hopsing things go well with your transition. You are doing the right thing-hang in there!!

Thanks again, for everyone's wishes.

We ended up telling her on Thursday, and that was her last day. We paid her for an additional 2 weeks. She put up some resistance, claiming that we owed her a bonus and pay for vacation. However, we had already given her more time off than the pre-specified number of vacation days, and I never promised her a bonus. In addition, she claimed that I needed to give her 2 weeks notice, allow her to work, and pay her 1 month of pay beyond this.

Today (Saturday), she called my cell phone over 10 times and left 2 messages. 1 message was that she left sweater at the house. My husband called her back that we would mail her the sweater. The other message was that she needed a letter stating the dates that she worked for us and a list of her duties. I haven't provided this sort of letter before, and I am a little hesitant to write this letter because I am concerned that it may be used for other purposes than as reference for her future employer. I thought that usually, references were made by telephone. When she applied with us, she listed 2 previous nanny jobs on her application, and did not provide us with letters.

I must add, when she interviewed with us, she did provide phone numbers for her previous jobs, and her previous employers both told me she performed her job well, but they had to let her go because they did not need a nanny anymore. There did not seem to be any red flags.

Honestly, her calling me over 10 times today is freaking me out.

I bet she's trying to get unemployment. And next time you or your husband call her, I would mention a restraining order if this behavior does not cease. Let her know she can contact you by mail or email or some other nonthreatening way only. This woman sounds like a head case, glad you got her out of there!

Oh, and keep the calls in your phone memory, so if you DO need a restraining order, you have evidence.

You are under no obligation to provide her a letter. She is just looking to avoid having to put down your phone number as a reference and wants something that shows that she has been working during this time to avoid a gap in her work history. Just tell her that you will confirm her dates of employment and duties for anyone who might call for a reference and leave it at that. That being said, if anyone does call, you are only obligated to confirm her dates of employment. If you do only that and refuse to say anything else about her, the prospective employer will get the message loud and clear.

Good riddance!!!

This lady keeps calling me. It has been over 15 times this weekend. She was irritated that I didn't return her call yesterday. I called her back nicely this morning that we were sending her the sweater and I will write a letter stating she worked for us as a live-in nanny from x date to x date.

So my question is, is it unwritten custom to give your nanny a bonus equivelent to 1 month of salary after 1 year of work? I did not agree to this but this lady keeps calling me to tell me I am a jerk for not giving her notice and owe her more money.

Then she called back an hour later and demanded a bonus equivalent to 1 month's salary, telling me that when we met for the first time, that she told me that she requires a bonus after 1 year and I agreed by nodding. She also acused me of being a cheapskate, and how dare I fire her just to avoid paying her the 1 year bonus. You all know that is not the case at all.

I would write a letter listing the dates AND the reasons you fired her. HA. No, there is no customary one month bonus. There is a customary 2 weeks severance, and you have already agreed to that. Anything that is not in writing does not exist, period. She sounds like she is seriously off her rocker. Did you change your locks? Take her off the daycare consents? Etc? I would also follow through with telling her you're going to file a police complaint if she doesn't back off.

She is being abusive. Don't answer her calls. Soon enough she should get the message and get on with her life.

OMG, she is clearly deranged. There is no such thing as a customary one month bonus. Bonuses are given at the discretion of the employer for excellent work. Bonuses are not demanded by employees. Do not answer her calls anymore---ever. If you have never read "The Gift of Fear" by Gavin DeBecker, now might be a good time to pick up a copy.

In "The Gift of Fear," I believe, there was a discussion of how to respond to harassment like that. A common response is to threaten to call the police/get a restraining order. The author argued that that this kind of thing can actually escalate matters, and that one should instead cease all contact. The author strongly encourages people to be alert for signs of danger. If you have not read the book yet, this would be a good time to do so.

Absolutely agree with changing the daycare consent. Make sure everyone at the daycare understands the situation and does not allow her any contact with your children whatsoever.

I posted before I saw your post, AnnaM!

Hmmm, I guess I need to get that book.

I should probably pick up the book at the library...

You have a good point. I am afraid now.

We never put her name on the daycare consent. When my husband was working, he would pick them up afterwork. Now that he is not working, he picks them up in the afternoon.

There are discussions of what's common w/r/t bonuses here:
http://parents.berkeley.edu/advice/childcare/nanny/bonus.html. Take home: about a week's pay seems common. But, of course, that's generally a bonus for a nanny that you *like* - ie, not one that you're in the middle of firing.

So, I'd say (1) 1 month pay as a bonus is totally in left field even for a totally adored, long time nanny; (2) a nanny who's not been doing well and is being fired? Don't feel any obligation to pay anything!

I think it's really hard to let a nanny go. We let our first nanny go when things didn't work out, and it was awkward and unpleasant for sure - and she didn't even live with us. Having someone in your home, caring for your baby... it's really a very intimate relationship for everyone involved. It's hard for the end of that not to feel very personal. I think she probably feels resentful and angry. But, it doesn't mean you're doing anything wrong. It sounds like you've made good decisions, and shouldn't feel guilty about them in the slightest.

Good luck!

Hi, tsunami.

I've been reading along with shock at what your ex-nanny has been saying... is she in legal trouble? using drugs? ( enough speculation... )

definitely a good decision to let her go, nice to offer the bonus, fabulous your husband is supporting you in this.

*DEFINITELY* CHANGE THE LOCKS. Hopefully she's just been used to getting money for not really working, and she'll back off soon enough.

and, I'm not recommending since I don't have enough experience, but what about just getting the restraining order/ making the report without threatening it to her? Ladies?

ohiomommd, I will give my opinion, but I am no expert in police matters! I think she should definitely get the police involved if there is a specific threat, such as a threat to harm anyone in the family or kidnap the children, or if she is stalking any of them. Short of that, I think it is a judgment call. Rich and famous people pay the author's company to make that kind of judgment for them. For the rest of us, reading the book can help us figure out whether a situation is dangerous or just annoying. The author also emphasizes the importance of listening to our survival instincts that tell us when we are in danger.

I think you are right, though, that if she needs the police, she should just call them and not first threaten to call them.

LOL sahmd. Apparently great minds DO think alike.

So we have been free from our nanny for the past 2 weeks. Things are going well. My husband is enjoying making dinner for us and since he has the day free while the kids are in daycare, he has time for recreation and relaxation.

I have received 3 phone calls to ask for reference for our former nanny, all of the jobs involve her being at home with 1 or 2 children while the professional parents are at work. My husband is an attorney, and he advised me that I should just confirm her dates of employment and her duties. One phone call was from another physician in my large multi-specialty group. The next day, that physician sent me an email at work, asking why I kept sending my kids to daycare if I had a nanny and asking about why she left. Apparently, the nanny had told her that she had worked for us for 2 years, and after us, she had worked with a family taking care of a newborn and a 2 year-old. When I told her that the nanny had only worked with us for 1 year and that her last day with us was last week, she was appalled.

BTW, our former nanny left me a voicemail this weekend expressing her concern, asking if we were able to manage, and telling me that she has other job opportunities but wanted to give us the opportunity to hire her back at her previous salary (no raise).

Don't respond to the voicemail. Glad things are going well.

Thanks for the great update!

This story is both scary and hilarious, depending on your viewpoint! A friend of mine was a nanny during undergraduate years--he is a fluent French speaker so he was paid a very good wage to look after 2 kids and speak to them only in French--the parents told their kids that he didn't speak any English, so they would have to speak to him in French. This situation worked out wonderfully as far as I could see for both parties for 2 years (but granted, he was only available in the afternoons since he was also a full-time student.) Also, I used to take care of a baby for about 8 hrs/week during undergrad years and loved it--I really enjoyed playing with a baby during breaks from lectures and studying. Not that I have ANY experience with hiring nannies, but I wonder if seeking out college students might be a good idea, even if you had to hire more than one to meet schedules. I think I would be inherently a little suspicious of anyone who wanted to be a "career nanny," but then again I'm sure there are some great ones out there (just not your former one, apparently!)

One quick note - if you did provide the letter about her employment make sure you've paid all the requisite taxes. I'm sure you have (if I remember correctly your husband is an attorney?). If you haven't paid the taxes and she decides to go after you you could have some trouble.

I was a live-in nanny (au pair) many years ago and I would never have dared to ask for my personal expenses (toiletries, snacks, phone bill) to be reimbursed, that is what my weekly stipend was for... especially since you are providing room & board already and paying her a very high salary.
As an au pair, I provided about 45 hours of childcare for 18-months-old triplets and a 5-year-old girl... the cost per hour is about $7.5 per hour for great quality childcare and a dedicated, motivated, energetic nanny and member of the family... and for exposure to a second language and culture, which was really neat especially for the 5-year-old.

Let me know if I can help you Tsunami and good luck!

Glad things are working out better as your husband sounds like he's helping out more. We pay our nanny around $12.50 an hour and she does an awesome job with our 2 young children.